Natalia Lebedeva is a well-known business coach, psychologist with 25 years of experience, associate professor at the university, and organizer of hundreds of events, including the “First National Congress of Coaches” and the international festival “Anima”. She doesn’t just work in the event industry – she shapes its semantic and emotional depth. We talked to Natalia about why events are needed in times of turbulence, what a truly strong program is, and why good events always have a place for knowledge, tears, and even karaoke.
WHEN EVERYTHING IS BREAKING DOWN, IT'S IMPORTANT TO BE ONE WITH EACH OTHER
– Natalia, the first and probably most important question: is it worth holding events during the war at all? How appropriate is it? Or, on the contrary, does it cause internal dissonance in people?
– About six months after the war began, it became clear: this is not just appropriate – it is very much in demand. People began to actively seek opportunities to be together, to unite. This is a human need.
There is one important rule: we heal in the presence of another person. And if the event is built taking into account the current psychological state of people, with an understanding of the context – what the country is going through – it does not turn into a “feast during the plague”. It becomes something else: a source of strength, faith, inspiration. This is what helps us cope with what is happening.
Therefore, despite the war, many events are being held.
– Charity events are held by volunteers, there are many events from the state and many from coaches. What, in your opinion, is really useful in this? And in general, is it appropriate to talk about benefits in the context of events?
— First of all, it's simple: demand creates supply. If we see so many different events today, then there is a demand for them. There is interest in them, and this is an indicator.
And when there is demand, there is competition. Time will tell how healthy this competition is. But in any case, as we know, under such conditions, the customer wins.
As for the benefit, only the participant can assess it. For one person, it may be an important insight, for another, it may just be a good mood. If a person doesn't feel the return, they simply won't come back. It's all fair.
I would say this: the event market is now alive and active. As a business coach and business psychologist, I can say that an event is a product. And the value of any product is determined by the client with his wallet. Will he buy it again? This is the most important indicator.
– Today, the market is perhaps even oversaturated with similar events. How do you think a person can sort through all this flow? How to separate truly beneficial events from those that can even harm?
– Yes, there are really a lot of events on the market now, sometimes too similar to each other. And the question of who will stay is a matter of time. But, of course, it is not easy for people to navigate.
The first filter through which everything happens is marketing. If the organizer approaches the matter seriously, he first thinks over the program, studies the needs of his audience, analyzes the market and adjusts the advertising so that it finds exactly those who may be interested in this event. That is, ideally, marketing is already part of the selection.
And then – the responsibility lies with the participant. Because you can be enchanted by the beautiful packaging, but disappointed by the content. Or vice versa – suddenly get much more than you expected.
How do you know if an event will be useful? We all seek emotional impact first and foremost: we want to feel uplifted, inspired, meet “our” people, and be fulfilled. This is the first criterion.
The second is a sense of meaning: when you go out and think, "I'll succeed," "I'm in the right place," "I have support inside."
THE CUSTOMER VOTES WITH HIS WALLET. IF IT DOESN'T RETURN, IT MEANS IT WAS EMPTY
– And what should a truly high-quality event be like? What must it have so that a person truly leaves not just inspired, but with the feeling that it gave them something important?
There must be at least a minimal practical benefit. A skill, a tool, specifics. Because now there are so many motivational speakers who come out and simply say: "You have to! Do it! Go ahead!" But without saying exactly how to do it.
I say this both as an organizer and as a person who often finds himself in the role of a participant. Slogans are good, they give impetus. But as a psychotherapist with 25 years of experience, I know for sure: if there is no clear tool behind the impetus, the path can end in disappointment. A person was inspired, began to act - but did not understand what to do next, and faced failure. It hurts.
A typical example: at an event, ten speakers in a row say that you should be popular on social networks, work with the target audience, be useful... but no one explains how to do it specifically. As a result, the participant goes and says to himself: “I’m a loser, I didn’t succeed.” Therefore, motivation should still be dosed. There should be exactly as much of it as needed.
And here is my principle, which I insist on and which I teach others: a good event should provide three things. knowledge, recognition and motivation.
And by recognition I don't mean applause for speakers, but respect for participants: letting them feel that they can, that they will succeed, that they are worthy. These three components are mandatory. The proportions may vary depending on the format, but all three ingredients must be present. This is my approach.
— How do you position yourself in the event industry today? And tell us how it all started?
— I would say that I was one of the first to enter the event industry intellectually. I put it this way: “intellectual event industry” is my path.
Although at the beginning of my career I liked everything related to emotions: both the advertising agency and even the wedding industry attracted me. This is part of my personality – I am drawn to emotions, to live communication. But at the same time I am always for education, for depth, for an academic approach.
Historically, everything turned out so that at the age of 23 I was the head of the psychological service in the Odessa city education department. And I had to organize educational events for psychologists - seminars, conferences, meetings. This was part of my job load.
And then came the turning point. At 26, I was going to go on maternity leave, and as soon as the management found out about it, I was instructed to conduct all the training events planned for the year, literally three months before the official departure. I still remember how during this short period I conducted an insane number of professional events. It was, you could say, my “intensive”.
In parallel with this, I worked in one of the bright American network companies. And it was there that I first saw how motivational events should work. After all, people in network business need to be inspired - and they don't have a salary, only interest. And this was the 90s - the beginning of the 2000s. It was necessary to somehow convince people to work practically for free. And at these events, where from a hundred to seven thousand people gathered, I saw power: how people are inspired, how they have a desire to succeed, how their eyes light up. I literally experienced all this myself.
Later, we in the team started organizing events ourselves, and I went from a participant to an independent organizer, and then to a director and author of my own projects.
As a result, I always had two pillars: the education system and business. This double foundation – education plus sales – made me who I became: a business psychologist and a specialist in motivational events. And this is what formed my understanding: an event is not just an event, but one of the ways to motivate people to work better.
— And what role, in your opinion, does education play in the profession of a psychologist, coach, or mentor? After all, today every second person calls himself an expert. Is personal experience enough to lead people? Is it really impossible to do without education?
— I am an Old Believer. I am for classical academic education at its core. And then – yes, you can and should add reformist approaches: new knowledge, modern research, innovations, new tools. But the base must be there.
Probably my strong point is that I teach at the university, work as an associate professor of the department. This is obliging. I constantly read new research, scientific articles, conduct and create my own. Therefore, I always keep my finger on the pulse, I know what is happening in my field, what tools specialists are currently working with. This gives me confidence.
But on the other hand, if you don’t have a base, then there’s simply no point in applying this knowledge. It’s like building a house on sand. Theoretically, you can… but the question is, how long will it stand?
Therefore, especially in areas where you influence the psyche, the inner state of people, where you lead, there must be a reliable foundation. And I believe that this is precisely academic education.
I am for education. And then – for development. Base plus growth.
And that's exactly how it was for me. It was thanks to education that I first believed that I can. This feeling should come to everyone at some point: "I can do this." It came to me in the late 90s, when I had just graduated from university and started working as a psychologist in the education system. At that time, the structure of the city service was being formed and my teacher was building it. And then she decided to return to teaching and wrote a memo to the department, recommending me for her position.
Imagine, I was only 23 years old, and she already saw a professional in me. Like, I see my student, my pupil Natalia Lebedeva for this position - she has excellent academic knowledge and undeniable organizational skills. " And now, recently, going through the documents and seeing this report note, I realized that this is probably the best recognition, the best award. Now I have this document in a frame.
— And when did you realize that this was not just a profession, but a calling, a lifelong endeavor?
— Probably, this feeling came with the birth of the “Anima” project. I was 35 years old then, I was already quite mature – and for the first time I got into a project that combined both a holiday and an intellectual content. I was invited to speak in Kyiv as a speaker, and I suddenly felt: “This is it. This is how it is possible. This is both beautiful and profound.
With each new festival, starting preparations two months in advance, we would get together with the team and ask ourselves the same question: what can we do differently? what can we improve? We were constantly watching how trends were changing, what was important to people here and now. And at some point I realized – this was no longer just a job. It became a mission.
And with the beginning of the war it became supermission. Because many people left, the team disbanded, but the festival was already taking place in different cities.
And strangely enough, it turned out to be a plus: we had to recruit new organizers throughout Ukraine, and then in Europe. Because our directors, our local coordinators left – some to Germany, some to Poland, some to Spain. And we started working with them there.
So Anima gradually became international from an all-Ukrainian festival. Now we have already built a system, structure, methodology. And we teach this to new franchisees, with whom we continue to develop this project. This is no longer just an event, but a whole culture.
DO YOU WANT A GREAT TEAM? STOP TAKING EVERYTHING ON YOURSELF
— How do you select your team? How do you find the people you're ready to move forward with?
– You know, I have a feeling that the team is just drawn to me. Seriously. I'm one of those people who, when starting any event, is ready to do everything myself. Straight from the series "I "alone." But at some point you realize: you physically can't take everything out alone - and you start asking for help.
And magic always happens here. There are people who just come and say: “Let me help you.” Someone offers to be a photographer, someone – to help with social networks, with organization. I never refuse. I take everyone. And then I see – how the person will show themselves.
If I see that a person is involved, proactive, and does things with all their heart, I officially invite them to join the team for the next project. That's how everything grows with us - very organically. Gradually. Without a rigid system.
Sometimes I take very young people — those who are just starting out in marketing, SMM, events. Sometimes they are former participants who were inspired by the process. The main thing for me is proactivity.
Plus – I really appreciate the ability to be friends. In our team, the principle of friendship, mutual respect and support is really important. We don’t have a formal division: “you’re only for this”. Yes, everyone has their own areas of responsibility, but if something “sags” somewhere, we pick each other up. I’m for multidisciplinary. And for everyone’s inclusion in the process.
For example, our entire team sits in on brainstorming sessions. It doesn't matter if it's the moderator or the person who runs social media. Because everyone has to understand everything – the entire context, all the points of contact with the audience.
It happened to me that the girl from the reception later became the moderator of the hall. And then she opened her own project. And that's cool. That's growth.
So, yes, I don't have a selection system. People come on their own, I just notice those who shine and give them the opportunity. And technically, I sit down before each event, prescribe all the processes: what I do myself, where I need help, what needs to be delegated. Now, of course, there is already a pool of people who I can just call. But it also happens that someone leaves - and you have to look for a new person. And they appear - just as cool, who occupy the empty niche.
— How many people work in your team? Approximately how many people join the project during the year? How many people do you need to put on a really good event?
– That’s a good question. In principle, 6–7 people are enough, sometimes up to 10. That’s enough to handle the entire basic structure: organization, marketing, partnership, program.
Closer to the event, we add about 10 more people — this is the operations team. Those who greet guests, help with logistics, work at registration. This is an important front of work, without them we can't do anything.
But what's interesting is that many of those who come as "pick-ups" can later grow up and become part of the permanent team. This often happens with us.
— And does it happen that a person grows up next to you – and at some point they are ready to sail on their own? How do you feel about this? Are there those who left your team, but went their own way and at the same time maintained a relationship with you – a partnership, a mentorship?
– I can say that this is my entire team. I will explain why. Seven years ago I created a project, the Psychology corporation, and from the beginning I positioned it as an association of professionals of a certain level. At first, these were my students. And now these are people with autonomous businesses, with their own projects, directions, clients.
But what's cool is that we still remain a team. Just flexible. When necessary, we unite for a specific task or project, creating synergy. And it works not only in my favor: we also help each other if someone has a launch, event, or professional challenge. This is very valuable.
I look with admiration at those who have gone into their own practice, who have opened their own company, created their own brand. And we are not competitors. On the contrary, we support each other, share clients, knowledge, resources. And sometimes we unite again and do something together.
If I lead the project, they come and help. If it’s their project, I calmly stand next to them and follow them. We don’t have an authoritarian hierarchy, no one shouts: “I’m your director.” We recognize leadership in a specific context, in a specific project. And I respect the leadership of each of them in their field.
There were very touching moments. For example, when people who graduated from my schools organized big events themselves – and invited me as a top guest. Sometimes they called me the “godmother of the project”. And this is probably the best gratitude.
— Is the program primary? Is it possible to come up with a topic first, and then draw up the program closer to the date? However, it often happens that it is born literally at the last moment.
– I am against this approach. I am for the program. And I will explain why. The difference between an event that has a clear structure and one where chaos reigns is very noticeable. After all, it is not only what happens in the moment that is important, but what remains with the person after.
Here comes a participant from the event. I ask: “How are you?” — “Well, it was not bad.” — “And what did you take for yourself?” — And silence. If a person is unable to remember specific meanings, then they were simply laid down. So, the event will quickly fade away, leaving no trace.
For me, the program is about meaning, it is the foundation on which everything rests. In my understanding, the organizer is not just a coordinator. He is the author of the idea and the author of the program. Yes, later the team helps to refine it, expand it, adapt it. But do not change it along the way, even if someone insists.
Because if you lose interest in your program, if it becomes a compromise, then there is no energy in it anymore. And without energy, there will be no result.
You can endlessly refer to marketing, saying that it sells better now... But I'm sure: if you feel that what you're doing is right, you'll sell it. Because it will be alive.
The second life hack is a team. It is very important to assemble a core that will have different types of thinking. We definitely need creative people – those who are passionate, inspiring, and come up with ideas. We definitely need critical thinkers. Those who will “squirm,” but get down to business. This is necessary.
But who should not be taken are skeptics who devalue. Those who seem to want to, but criticize at every turn, destroying the atmosphere. Critical thinking - yes. But criticism for the sake of criticism - no. It destroys.
Believe me, you already know all the cons of your project very well. And the team should be the one that supports you, loves you, and helps you do better – without destroying your motivation.
And another important point: People who just work for a salary will never do better than those who come because they truly care about what you do.
That's our strength. All of our events, from those who greet guests and hand out badges to top speakers and organizers, are staffed by people who are burning with the idea. It is important for them to be part of this process. They understand, why guests come here, what we want to convey, which We set the level of quality and meaning.
They don't just work - they are involved. That is, they see their belonging, their involvement in a common goal, and this is what creates the very atmosphere that money cannot buy.
— Are you afraid of your audience? And in general, should you be afraid? Especially when it comes to large-scale events – for a hundred, 500 or 1000 people. How do you understand how many people you are comfortable working with?
– Fear is always there. I can honestly say: it is absolutely normal to be afraid.
I've had events with 50 to 1000 people. And I was equally afraid that I wouldn't make it to 50... and that I wouldn't make it to a thousand. This is a classic.
The scariest half hour is when the guests are still gathering. Those 30 minutes are when you feel like your nervous system is just about burnt out. And then you see that the hall is at least two-thirds full – and you exhale.
I think every organizer faces this. Only some talk about it honestly, and some try to to get dust in one's eyes. Well, that's a matter of taste. There are those who come out and say: "We have two thousand people here!" — and in fact, in the hall, well, four hundred. I can already tell by eye how many people are actually in the hall. And when someone starts lying to themselves and the audience, it always looks a little ridiculous.
— No matter how cool the coach is, can you seriously expect that after one 45-minute performance you will come out as if you had a full-fledged training? Or is this an illusion that will only disappoint you later?
– Definitely: you shouldn’t expect the impossible. What can you get from a strong coach in one performance? A little knowledge, a little motivation, and a little recognition. Everyone will just get it in their own proportion – whoever came for what they came for will get it. Someone will be inspired. Someone will understand an important idea. Someone will feel supported.
That is, the event is more of a trigger than a full-fledged educational program.
I often perform at events myself, I'm on both sides of the stage. And of course, I'm pleased when people come up to me and say: "We came here for you, we bought tickets." It's very inspiring.
But I always remember: you can't give a full-fledged training in 40–45 minutes. That's why, when I build my presentation, I always set myself the task of giving one or two specific skills that a person can immediately apply.
— Are there situations when organizers use speakers more as "decorations" for their own PR? How common is this mistake and how do you feel about it?
— And, for example, I'll be honest: it annoys me sometimes. I don't like to be a background for someone. As a speaker, I wouldn't want to be a background for an organizer.
It is very important that the speaker does not become a decoration. If the organizer simply gathers a crowd to then take a picture in front of it and "show off" without giving anything in return, it is a failure.
— So you held the event, it's over. What's next? What do you do the first or second day after it? What's the aftertaste left for you?
— I restore my strength. Usually it's something simple: a bath, water, silence.
It's not even so much physical as emotional recovery. Because it takes a lot of energy. And, of course, this feeling: "Yes, I did it."
Previously, the next day I would immediately gather the team for a debriefing, a planning meeting, and a summary. Now I understand: no. I need to give myself a break. Better on the second or third day. Not right away.
If everything coincides on the dates, we already have a cool tradition: to go somewhere with the whole team and have a good time. We love karaoke – it's direct therapy.
And then – we turn on our brains: we do an analysis. We look at the finances, the statistics – how many people actually came. We look at the feedback we received. We note what worked particularly well – even if it was spontaneous, and it definitely needs to be repeated. And what, on the contrary, did not work out – and we also record that.
Because the next event will be in a month, two, three – and if you don’t write it down right away, half of it will simply be forgotten. I have my own big notebook for each project. I’m probably an old-timer in this too. In these notebooks I record everything: goals for the event, conclusions after someone I got angry with, someone I admired, someone I met, what was nice. This is my tool for memory and growth.
— You work a lot – how do you combine it all? Where in all this can you find a personal life, rest, family? After all, it is very important that there is more than just work in life.
— I definitely have a bias. I'm a workaholic. And what's more, I suffer when I have a lull.
But at the same time, I simply made my family love what I love. My family participates in this hubbub. We know how to hear each other. For example, if at some point someone feels bad about my EGG (internal noise, activity) - they simply give me space: they don't demand that I be silent. And I, in turn, don't insist that they get involved. But I'm always glad and waiting if someone wants to be there. And in extreme cases - just at home, with flowers.
Olena Ovchinnikova spoke
